I'd like to do a little bit of work to the lawn this fall. I'm a novice to lawn care but I've been at it a few years and had some decent results towards my objective. I have overseeded before. My objective isn't an elite KBG lawn. Right now it is a Scott's Thermal Bluegrass blend. I'd just like it green, thick and without weeds. I wouldn't mind the cost of overseeding and patching bare spots with an elite seed to add to the appearance.

I'm hoping to use this thread as a way to ask some questions and get some experienced help along the way.

I am located in Fairfield, Connecticut.

I'd like to get this seeding started very soon. So far I have started taking undesirable grasses/weeds mostly by hand. The lawn isn't too big so I don't mind the work.

Most of my time so far has been going towards pulling this out:



The first photo is what I think is smooth crabgrass. It comes out fairly easy and I get the roots. Will it begin to die off as the weather cools? The second photo is of some mystery grass/weed that I cannot identify. Although I am getting out the roots I'm worried I'll miss some and it will just come back. I have been using multiple university turf/weed sites but can't get a definite match. Any ideas?

Thanks in advance for help along the way!

Step 1 get a soil test from Logan Labs or UMASS. great seed + bad soil = bad grass
Step 2 post results here, Andy, Morph and a few others are the soil test guru's and will help you out free of charge

A trophy lawn is not my objective right now. The soil has supported a healthy lawn for more than a few years. I agree a soil test is a good idea but that might turn my project into a different route. I'm a bit obsessive and trying to keep this simple!

I have a few issues and am trying to erase them. Although I've done it a couple times with good results I'm looking for some tips through the overseed process and thought a thread dedicated to my project was a good way to get help, but I feel you misunderstood a bit.

First question was identification and removal tips of the grasses/weeds I wanted out.

If your goal, as you stated in your 1st post is "a thick green lawn without weeds", then the advice to get a simple soil test is absolutely where you should start as good soil will allow your lawn to get and remain thick which will naturally crowd out most weeds! Without good soil,everything is a constant uphill battle.Without knowing what type soil conditions you are dealing with,everything is a guessing game!

Welcome, HkyPlur!!!

Do yourself a big favor and update your profile to indicate either "Fairfield CT" or "So CT". I saw the "NYC" and immediately pictured two 4' X 4' squares on the sides of the stoop. Lots of members here from CT.

andy10917 wrote:Welcome, HkyPlur!!!

Do yourself a big favor and update your profile to indicate either "Fairfield CT" or "So CT". I saw the "NYC" and immediately pictured two 4' X 4' squares on the sides of the stoop. Lots of members here from CT.

Me too Andy!!

I will get moving on the soil test immediately. Thanks for talking me into it.

Temperatures are currently in the high 70s during the day and mid-60s at night-- when should I plan to be all set to drop seed?

Today is great for dropping seed. No, really, temperatures are exactly right...

I have decided on a full renovation of the front and back lawns.

I started to kill off all existing lawn about five days ago. There is significant browning and I am starting to cut it off as it dies.

I will be having soil delivered to level a few areas. Should I wait for complete kill before doing this? I'd like to be ahead of the game. There are only a few areas that need significant leveling, most of the area will have short dead lawn as a seed blanket.

As directed by Logan Labs I will wait for the new soil to be added before sending in my sample.

Here is my rough plan:

Kill
Scalp/Level/Roll
Soil Sample
Seed/starter fertilizer/peat moss/soil moist(?)/apply nutrients to lawn based on soil report

What am I forgetting? I am hoping to have the seed in within 7-14 days. Is that time frame too short?

Should I aerate or add anything to the soil now? I have milorganite and lime on hand, should I wait for soil sample to be examined? Where would a Tenacity application fall into the process?

As for seed I want an all bluegrass lawn. I will be combining 3 species but am currently undecided-- any suggestions? There is only one shaded area, I cut branches below 8' for added sun. The lawn doesn't get much traffic other than two dogs, and I'd like the turf to be as resistant as possible to dog play. Should I have all the seed species mixed or add only a certain type to the shaded areas?

The BL site has been a great learning tool! I still have much to learn and I appreciate all of your suggestions.

Add nothing major until post the soil sample. If your pH is high, we don't want to bollix that! If low, we'll work with it later.

The only thing on the list is that rolling is done after the seeding unless you have some really bad areas that may need it before and after to settle them a touch. Fourteen days might be a bit late, but you're still just within the window. Let's hope for seven.

So it's OK to start burying some un-dead lawn to level?

Post Round-Up? Sure. Before that, I wouldn't. Some will come back unless they're really buried, and even then you might get a bit.

MorpheusPA wrote:The only thing on the list is that rolling is done after the seeding unless you have some really bad areas that may need it before and after to settle them a touch

The soil's being delivered Friday-- I have a few very low spots I plan to fill in. I should fill in/level, roll, then roll again after seeding, correct?

There will be a good deal of sq. footage that will have dead grass-- how short should I cut and should I rake a bit first? Does it depend on my thatch?

Also, I'm trying to decide on what to use as a top dressing:

I was planning on peat to help hold the seed in, and adding some soil moist as well. When I was at the landscape center and asked about peat, they said their compost will retain moisture better. Is that true? What's my best option here, and how much should I drop over the seed? 1/4" of peat or compost?

Thanks everybody, sorry for so many questions!

Fill, roll, seed, roll would be the way I'd do it. It's overkill, but going to give the best grading as you'll have time to correct it between first roll and seeding.

How much thatch? Most of us just cut as low as we can with our mowers and bag it. Then seed. The old dead grasses make a great seeding blanket.

Either compost or peat is fine. Compost probably retains water better, but with the Soil Moist that really doesn't matter much any longer. With good watering, it never really mattered anyway. Compost is also much heavier per cubic yard...a consideration for me at least! In either case, 1/4" is the correct amount, but you can short that a bit.

What is the best way to post the .pdf of my soil sample results? I'm having a hard time...

Got it. Please let me know your thoughts. I'm hoping to get the seed down tomorrow...



Thanks everybody!

While there are no red flags, some things should be adjusted after the seed sprouts.

pH 5.9: A touch low. Once Andy has power, he'll be along to evaluate this--but I'm thinking some calcitic lime is in your future.

OM: Fine! Certainly more is better, but this is high in the Good range.

Phosphorus: You just got the crown for Highest Phosphorus of the Year at 1524. No starter is required at seeding time, nor should you use any. Excess P isn't an issue, but there's no need to add any more--and doing so is ecologically irresponsible in this case. 200 would be the target on this test for your pH.

Potassium: A touch low but nothing severe. Find potassium sulfate and apply at 1 pound per thousand in October and May, then see where you are. That should take care of the front and get you closer to optimal out back.

Sulfur/sodium: Normal.

Iron: This should be fine for a non-elite bluegrass lawn.

MorpheusPA wrote:Once Andy has power, he'll be along to evaluate this

From hanging around the site I see lots of quick replies and I was worried my thread was being overlooked after my update-- I completely forgot that many must still be out of power! My town was slammed by the hurricane, but somehow I escaped unscathed. I felt like a real jerk at Home Depot buying some extra peat moss, a hose and sprinkler while some were trying to clean up their lives after the storm.

MorpheusPA wrote:Phosphorus: You just got the crown for Highest Phosphorus of the Year at 1524. No starter is required at seeding time, nor should you use any. Excess P isn't an issue, but there's no need to add any more--and doing so is ecologically irresponsible in this case. 200 would be the target on this test for your pH.

Interesting. I wonder how this happened! None will be used.

MorpheusPA wrote:Iron: This should be fine for a non-elite bluegrass lawn.

Since my original posting I decided that an elite bluegrass lawn WAS what I wanted! I'm gonna drop a mix of 30/30/30 Midnight/Bedazzled/Award with some ryegrass thrown in. This board was a great influence on me

Here are the recommendations from Logan-- for some silly reason I feel better getting advice from the guys on BL!



Here's my plan for tomorrow's seed dropping:

Finalize the irrigation system
Spray Tenacity and give it about 1-2 hours to dry
Drop seed with soil moist coating
1/4" of peat moss
roll
water and wait

Am I forgetting anything?
Should I drop some lime now? Milorganite? Really, nothing else?

Thanks so much for all the help!

HkyPlur wrote:From hanging around the site I see lots of quick replies and I was worried my thread was being overlooked after my update-- I completely forgot that many must still be out of power! My town was slammed by the hurricane, but somehow I escaped unscathed. I felt like a real jerk at Home Depot buying some extra peat moss, a hose and sprinkler while some were trying to clean up their lives after the storm.

Ditto. I did have a few Thuja that flexed a bit in the storm. I'm buying clothesline to pull them back up, others are in the same aisle wondering whether the heavy chain would hold until they can take the tree down before it falls down the rest of the way on the roof. I felt somewhat...petty...actually.

Your pH isn't anything extreme at all--5.9 is workable for a reno. You'll want to adjust it upward toward the optimal range, but this isn't critically bad in any sense and it'll have to wait anyway. You never add lime when seeding.

Interesting. I wonder how this happened! None will be used.

Natural? Previous owner? Used to be a farm? No matter, you have enough for decades.

MorpheusPA wrote:Iron: This should be fine for a non-elite bluegrass lawn.

Since my original posting I decided that an elite bluegrass lawn WAS what I wanted! I'm gonna drop a mix of 30/30/30 Midnight/Bedazzled/Award with some ryegrass thrown in. This board was a great influence on me

Gotcha. Then it's OK but won't produce the most optimal color. Use Milorganite as your budget allows to slowly raise this, although it's high enough (about where mine is) that color certainly won't be shabby even if you never iron spray.

Here are the recommendations from Logan-- for some silly reason I feel better getting advice from the guys on BL!

Eight POUNDS of K3O? Are they INSANE? I mean, ultimately, maybe, but not all at ONCE. I'd NEVER exceed 2 pounds per thousand per month even in a 0 PPM potassium soil! And I don't think you'll need the eight; you should adjust tolerably well on 2 pounds total, maybe 3 or 4.

Dolomitic wouldn't be what I'd use here, either. Personally, I'd go calcitic as the Mg levels are really OK. Maybe a whisper of Epsom salt, but that's it.

Here's my plan for tomorrow's seed dropping:

Finalize the irrigation system
Spray Tenacity and give it about 1-2 hours to dry
Drop seed with soil moist coating
1/4" of peat moss
roll
water and wait

Am I forgetting anything?
Should I drop some lime now? Milorganite? Really, nothing else?

Thanks so much for all the help!

That covers it. We'll hold off on the lime probably until October unless Andy contradicts me on that, but I hate setting off a high-pH zone during seeding. The seed roots don't know things are much better down lower.

Milorganite is always a plus, always usable, and will help gently feed the new sprouts for quite some time.

MorpheusPA wrote:We'll hold off on the lime probably until October unless Andy contradicts me on that, but I hate setting off a high-pH zone during seeding. The seed roots don't know things are much better down lower.

Milorganite is always a plus, always usable, and will help gently feed the new sprouts for quite some time.

I'll drop some milorganite before I drop the seed and topdress. Normal rate?

If Andy doesn't chime in before tomorrow and I get all this done, would it be OK to drop some lime within a week after seeding?